Baltic | Simon Bajada
Baltic: New & Old Recipes: Estonia, Latvia & Lithuania
By Simon Bajada
Intro: Welcome to the number one cookbook podcast, Cookery by the Book with Suzy Chase. She's just a home cook in New York City, sitting at her dining room table talking to cookbook authors.
Simon Bajada: It's Simon Bajada speaking on my new cookbook, "New and Old Recipes: Estonia, Latvia & Lithuania.
Suzy Chase: For more Cookery by the Book, you can follow me on Instagram. If you enjoy this podcast, please be sure to share it with a friend. I'm always looking for new people to enjoy Cookery by the Book. Now on with the show.
Suzy Chase: The Baltic States were named among New York Times' 52 best places to go in 2018, so on to a little geography. The Baltic region encompasses three Northern European countries to the east of the Baltic Sea. Apparently Estonia is more Nordic of them all and Latvia and Lithuania are more Russian-influenced. Could you give us a little overview of the three different countries and where they're located?
Simon Bajada: Certainly. Estonia is in the north, most northern part, and I think that's why it gets some of its Nordic influence just geographically being there under Finland and with Sweden across to the west. Underneath Latvia is, yeah, one-quarter of the population today is still of Russian origin, and below that to the south, just north of Poland is Lithuania.
Suzy Chase: so here's a little factoid that I found out. Estonia has a huge startup culture, and thanks to them, we're chatting today on Skype.
Simon Bajada: Yeah, that's right. Yeah, I understand. Yeah, I understand that it was developed there. I'm not sure if they're all still operating out of there.
Suzy Chase: Probably not.
Simon Bajada: And also it's actually one of the first countries to offer in the world digital citizenship, so you can run a business out of a Estonia without actually being there.
Suzy Chase: Oh, that's shady.
Simon Bajada: Yes.
Suzy Chase: Latvia is where the most Russian families have remained post-independence. What's a classic Latvian Russian dish?
Simon Bajada: There's quite a few that that are still eaten there in the cuisine. Certainly, actually, there's one in the book that we could talk of where I've done a little modern adaptation being Rasols. It's a salad that was developed a long time ago, a cold salad, which uses boiled root vegetables, generally likely beets and potatoes, and it has a real assortment of other ingredients through it. It can be chopped ham, peas, even a smoked fish or cured fish, also chopped egg in there and it's all bound together with a mayonnaise. So everyone has a different recipe, and it's adapted a lot over the years, but it's certainly the origins are from Russia, and it's still eaten there today.
Suzy Chase: So Lithuania was once one of the largest European powers with a territory that extended from the Baltic Sea to the Black Sea close to the Ottoman empire. What happened to all that land?
Simon Bajada: Yeah, I find that fascinating in the historic research I did. I mean, it's a huge area. And also interesting is that it's always been a very multicultural place. Like as far back as the 14th century, a lot of royalty were invited from around Europe to set up there. To your question about what happened to it, I never actually found the answer to that, but I would assume that at some stage, Russia ended up encompassing the region because it was geographically a similar region, but the Russian empire came and and took over that land.
Suzy Chase: Speaking of the Russians, after 50 years of Soviet rule, what exactly is post-Soviet cuisine?
Simon Bajada: I think post-Soviet cuisine is the Baltic countries' answer to new Nordic cuisine. The young chefs realized that they could identify with their culinary roots rather than looking at other countries like Italian, French food, everyone loves. They thought, "Well, what's our food?" And that's certainly what happened in the Nordic countries, and they developed it into something hugely successful and modern. Everyone's felt the effects of that around the world. And I think the Baltic countries, being in a similar geographic region thought, "Oh, their produce is similar. Our techniques are similar." And so the young chefs have now been looking to what the foods were ahead of the Soviet times to identify more closely what their country's cuisine was, and they're making modern adaptations on that.
Suzy Chase: Can you describe the Baltic Way?
Simon Bajada: Yeah. That was also fascinating to read of in research because I actually didn't hear about it in the '80s, but I think it was around three million people across the three countries came together to unify and join hands and form a physical line of people in protest to Soviet occupation. And you saw the picture in the start of the book, perhaps.
Suzy Chase: Mm-hmm (affirmative), I sure did.
Simon Bajada: I think it speaks to the three countries working together as they do today, and yeah, I think it's a proud moment for them.
Suzy Chase: What are the smells in kitchens alongside the Baltic Sea?
Simon Bajada: Admittedly, I'm going to say that I'm not the most romantic writer, so I, actually, for the book turned to a local, and she was very generous to give some introductory text for the book. Yeah, [Sandra 00:00:05:50], a local in Latvia. But yeah, she, she talks about it. She talks about the ocean. She talks about all the smells coming from the forest, the mint growing wild, the smoke coming from smoke houses, I believe.
Suzy Chase: Yeah, the blue cheese and hemp butter.
Simon Bajada: Oh, yes, yes. She talks about the hemp butter. That's a really interesting ingredient to find being used there, actually, because it's not so common in many cuisines. The farmers used to use the oil from the hemp seed to condition their hands because of all the hard labor, and they also started to realize that the oil could be used in salads and crushed to go in butters, et cetera. And I think through the Soviet time, the farms were closed down, and they stopped the production. Since the '90s, it's experiencing a bit of a resurgence, and now there's been leniency on the laws so people can grow the hemp again, and it's a product you'll find in the supermarkets.
Suzy Chase: I read that you said there's no personal backstory to this book. What prompted you to write it?
Simon Bajada: I've always loved foreign cuisines, and when I visit places, it's all I'm looking for, those little nuances about something that's unique or a technique that's unique. And I first visited Latvia in 2008 and visited a restaurant, which is still there today. They're actually a small chain where the local Latvian food is served on a buffet every day. I just couldn't believe it. When I walked in and saw these dishes, I was taking notes immediately.
Simon Bajada: One of the first things I saw was the chilled beet soup, which is also eaten in other countries, Poland, Russia. But that was the first time I saw it. And then all of a sudden there's this assortment of cabbage dishes and pickled dishes and everything. And it just grabbed my attention.
Simon Bajada: And since 2008, I visited over the years, living here in Sweden and went on some press trips. And every time I visited I just dug a little deeper and deeper every time. And I started to realize that a lot of the recipes of the things I wanted to eat, they weren't appearing anywhere. So I thought, Oh, I'll make a little collection. And, and then I started to look for books, and I realized that some of the books were like very country-specific or a bit older. So that's when I came up with the idea to, to write the book and correlate the recipes.
Suzy Chase: That's so cool. I love foreign cuisines, too. And I'm so into cookbooks being part travelogue. I like to learn about the culture along with the cuisines. And this book is just dreamy and perfect for your bedside table. I adore the photos so much. Did you take these photos?
Simon Bajada: I did, yes. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, I've had some great feedback from some Baltic people who are living abroad and they in a way, in one way or another, they've said they've been waiting for this book and that when they got it and saw it, it really took them home and that it represented the landscape they were familiar with in their childhood, if it was their childhood they left or... So I'm really happy that as a writer and a photographer, that that's made me really happy.
Suzy Chase: Oh, my gosh. That's the best compliment you could ever get.
Simon Bajada: Yeah, it's fantastic. Yeah. You know, It's a daunting task to write about another country's cuisine. There's no doubt. And I think having an outside eye looking in sometimes can help. But you know, I got some really interesting information from chefs and local people who helped for the whole project and, and there's been some great feedback. So that makes me really happy. I mean, all I want to do is share the food with people around the world because they're little-known countries, and there's not much out there about their food. So it's, it's great to see that it's doing the job.
Suzy Chase: Why do you think this is a little explored culinary region?
Simon Bajada: They're not countries that everyone visits. They're small countries. We hear very little from them and a lot of people would assume that the food is similar to the neighboring countries, and in a way, at times it can be very similar, but there's also those little differences that make each country's cuisine unique. So it's exciting to dig and have a look at that and share it.
Suzy Chase: In the cookbook, the first chapter highlights the Baltic love of dairy. Talk a little bit about that.
Simon Bajada: They've always been agrarian societies where they rely on the land and eat from the land. And I mean, you can go into the Riga Central Market and just see the love of dairy. There's huge selection of cheeses, a lot that are very unfamiliar. We were talking about hemp seeds. There's hemp seeds through cheese. Then you might have different consistencies of the cheese with hemp seeds, and there's ingredients and different forms of dairy that we are not familiar with. You might have sour milks with various sourness or different fat contents.
Simon Bajada: Also the fresh cheese, which is then turned into curd cheese. Cheese ends up in chocolate ,as you might've seen in the book. You know, and the first recipe in the book is an ode to that. The summer milk soup is just so simple, and yeah, I think it speaks volumes of the love of the dairy to have a soup that's just from milk.
Suzy Chase: What else is in it?
Simon Bajada: They use spring vegetables, which lovely and sweet in the middle of summer, and that's it. The most simple seasoning, salt and pepper, and yeah, I think it's a classic recipe that represents the region really well.
Suzy Chase: Another interesting recipe I read was on page 123. It's the Piragi?
Simon Bajada: Oh, yes, the Piragi, yes, from Latvia.
Suzy Chase: Yes. And it's a form of bragging rights. Talk a little bit about that.
Simon Bajada: Yeah, I came across that in research that historically that would be something that you would bring. I think in mid-summer all the communities get together and celebrate midsummer. It's also a time to celebrate the harvest and what the farm is yielding, et cetera. And it's said that if you were to bring a huge tray of those being filled of pork and made from wheat flour, it's served as a bragging right that things were going well.
Suzy Chase: Would you say rye bread is a staple in all three countries?
Simon Bajada: Yes, definitely. And it gets called black bread for some reason, and it's not always black. It can be a little more what we know as rye, but certainly in Lithuania, I noticed the way that they cook it, they make huge loaves, so it gets cooked at a lower temperature for a longer amount of time so that the heat can get all the way through the loaf, and this develops a really dark crust and that's why the bread turns black, whereas the inside actually isn't black. So I understand how it gets called black bread. And that's actually quite interesting because the loaf gets divided up into portions. So instead of buying your own individual loaf, you'll be at the market and it'd already be cut up and it will all be weighed and priced accordingly. So bread by weight essentially.
Simon Bajada: And you know there's there, there's a fantastic restaurant in Tallinn called LEIB, and that that name is the Estonian word for "bread." And I remember the first meal I had there, the chef, he always came out and spoke about the food. It's a fantastic restaurant. And I remember being quite surprised when he came and mentioned that dessert was going to be black bread ice cream. I'll never forget it, and it was delicious.
Suzy Chase: So what was that like?
Simon Bajada: Yeah, really good. I mean, all ice cream's fantastic. Everyone's had a million different flavors.
Suzy Chase: But how did they morph the bread into the ice cream?
Simon Bajada: I didn't ask him. I never got the recipe. I have since read a recipe. I'm trying to remember now, but I imagine that they... In the book you'll see a recipe for bread soup ,and that's a sweet dish where you cook down the rye bread with sugar and water, and it becomes like almost like a porridge. So my guess is they use that with an ice cream base to churn it together with freezing it at the same time. And then you have an ice cream. But it was lovely, sweet. It had the depth of almost like a beer or an ale.
Simon Bajada: And I must say that that recipe in the book for sweet bread soup really took me by surprise because I had had it in the countries, in Latvia in particular, and it's not the most beautiful-looking thing. And while I was reluctant to include it in the book, you know, I made a few times and every time it surprised me. There's something about it being chilled and sweet. It's a very interesting flavor and, and really, really nice paired with anything tart like a tart fruit and then a little cream. So I think that that would be very similar to what they did to make that black bread ice cream.
Suzy Chase: So last week I made your recipe for chilled beet root soup. Chilled beet root soup. That's hard to say. On page 26.
Simon Bajada: It's easier to say than the Lithuanian, though.
Suzy Chase: Yes. Describe this dish and how it was popular in Soviet times and how it epitomizes the flavors of the region.
Simon Bajada: The dish is essentially boiled beets, which have sweet earthy undertones, and then you mix through that some cucumber, but the predominant other ingredient is sour milk, what we also know is kefir, which creates the perfect balance between the beats and the and the dairy there. And then there's, yeah, the cucumbers, some chopped egg. You also add some more acidity through lemon juice if you like, and horseradish is also popular to have with it. And they all come together and make something really stunning.
Simon Bajada: I mean, I sat in the square at Vilnius last summer, and that's all I wanted. And it was hot. It was 30, which is not that common in that neck of the woods. And I just remember sitting there, having that soup as if it was having a gazpacho in Spain. I mean, it was so refreshing, and everything always tastes better than when you're there. But I must say I came back to Sweden, made it at home again, and on a hot day in love with it, I think it's something that people should take into their chilled soup repertoire, definitely for next summer.
Suzy Chase: Now to my segment called My Favorite Cookbook. Aside from this cookbook, what is your all-time favorite cookbook and why?
Simon Bajada: I've always been impressed by Escoffier the book, but I think given we're talking about Baltic cuisine, I'll mention one which listeners might not know of, and it is stunning. It's one of my favorite. It's called Proud of Lithuania: A Fairy Tale by Sweet Root, and Sweet Root is a restaurant in Vilnius that it's been, oh, I don't know how many years, but certainly been a very successful restaurant for maybe around five years, longer. And they have a book, which is mammoth. It's 350 pages. But it's just stunning. It's beautiful photography, amazing minimal design.
Simon Bajada: And yeah, when you're reading through it, the prose is great, and it really takes you to Lithuania and gives you a really strong understanding of the cuisine, and yeah. I mean, there's just a lot to like about it. I think it comes in with like 10 different sleeve options on the outside. So you can pick which sleeve you would like. And yeah, just talks a lot about the identity of Lithuanian cuisine. So it's beautiful. And there's not many. I think it's a limited run.
Suzy Chase: So is it newer or older?
Simon Bajada: It came out maybe two years ago.
Suzy Chase: Okay.
Simon Bajada: And when I look at it, yeah, the author is just by Sweet Root. So I think it was like a team effort. It's not actually written by them one particular chef or food writer. It's more they came together as a group, and a lot of the recipes are from the restaurant, but there's also really nice words about Lithuanian food culture, so yeah, love it.
Suzy Chase: So where can we find you on the web and social media?
Simon Bajada: I'm on @simonbajada on Instagram, and I also have a website, just simonbajada.com
Suzy Chase: It is indeed an exciting time for Baltic food. And thanks so much for chatting with me on Cookery by the Book podcast.
Simon Bajada: Thank you, Suzy. Thanks for having me on the show. Thanks.
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