Keep It Zesty | Edy Massih

Suzy Chase: When two podcasts collide, magic happens. Welcome to Dinner Party, the podcast where I bring together my two hit shows, Cookery by the Book and Decorating by the Book around here. We're all about cooking, sharing stories behind recipes, and creating a cozy home. I'm your host, Suzy Chase, a West Village wife, mom and home cook. Inspired by Martha Stewart trying to live in a Nora Ephron movie, surrounded by toile, plaid, cookbooks, decorating books and magazines, cooking in my galley kitchen and living my best life in my darling New York City apartment in the cutest neighborhood in the city, the West Village. So come hang out and let's get into the show.

Edy Massih: Hi there. My name is Edy Massih. I'm the owner of Edy's Grocer in Greenpoint, Brooklyn, and I'm the author of Keep It Zesty, a Lebanese cookbook that brings you Edy's grocer to your kitchen.

Suzy Chase: I think I met you in October, 2019 before the world lockdown at a Sumac Magazine event at Ludlow House, and I think you were catering it.

Edy Massih: Yes. Now I run the Food and Drink Club at Soho House. So I had invited the guy that started Sumac, which I can't. Ali Ali is his name. Yes. I had invited him to be the host that month, and that is where we met. Wow,

Suzy Chase: Great. That's so funny. Before times before everything closed, it's like, I don't know, could have happened. Maybe not, who knows?

Edy Massih: But now I remember that very well. Yes.

Suzy Chase: So in November, 2022, I interviewed Hisham Assaad. Do you know him?

Edy Massih: By the way? Yes, yes.

Suzy Chase: He wrote the cookbook Bayrut: The Cookbook.

Edy Massih: Yes, yes, yes.

Suzy Chase: And we briefly chatted about the horrific explosion that demolished Beirut in 2020. And Hisham said, I wrote about how despite it all, and I don't want to be romanticizing our struggles, but despite it all, we find a way to grow just like the fig tree that grows out of the harshest environments, we find a place to put our roots back and grow tall. So before we get into the cookbook, I just want to give you a little space to talk about your home, Lebanon, because food is culture, culture is home, and home is our family.

Edy Massih: It's been a hard week, I would say with everything that's going on there. And I think as I grow older, I get more and more attached to Lebanon, and I think it's such a weird thing. But when we moved here from Lebanon, I was like didn't really care as much about my culture, but I feel like now I'm so embedded in it and I care more than ever about it. And I think it's because I've learned how rich it is and how of a culture it is. And it's really sad to watch how Western media showcases us and what we are as a culture. And I think for me, one of my biggest things has always been to spread the joy of Lebanese cooking. And that is to take away that stigma of a war torn country and try to show how beautiful Beirut Lebanon really is.

And so I think especially right now, when I moved to the US in 2004, there was the 2006 war, there was 2008 war, then there was the 2020 explosion and so many things in between. And now to watch Lebanon be again in the media in 2024 for yet another war, it really breaks my heart. It breaks my heart for my people and it breaks my heart for my country to be shown the way that it is. And I think with everything that I do, I try to show the good side of Lebanon because it's not just about war, but unfortunately that is what is shown here. So to me today, especially with things that have been going on in the past two weeks in Lebanon, I am prouder than ever to be Lebanese. And I'm also prouder than ever owning Eddie's grocery here in New York to spread the joy of Lebanese cooking, but also to be able to support Middle Eastern owned businesses. I think that to me is really the greatest achievement that I've done here, is to be importing some great Mina owned businesses. And especially now we've been working with more smaller businesses back in Lebanon. I think that is just, to me, the biggest thing that I could do here from being afar away. And just like you're just scrolling on Instagram and you're seeing all these horrible pictures and videos and you're like, well, what can I do? And I feel like for me, this is what I could do here.

Suzy Chase: What could I do? What could we do?

Edy Massih: I think what people can do is support small businesses or buy Middle Eastern owned businesses or Middle Eastern products that are made there. I think at the end of the day, you're helping not just that business, but you're helping the farmers and everything that goes into that. So I think that's one really big thing I would like to say. And I think outside of that reading more and not just reading one bias newspaper, watching one video and being like, this is what I'm going to take from it. I think really reading and understanding a bit more where this all stems from. This doesn't just start out of nowhere. This is hundreds of years that go into this. And I think outside of that, of course, giving back donating and knowing where you're donating, like the Lebanese Red Cross, there's so many of these different homes and shelters that take in people, and I think either DMing them or donating straight to their website is the best way to do. I love Hellem, H-E-L-M-M, I think I'm spelling them right, but they are a queer shelter in Beirut and they take in queer kids that have been kicked out of their house. But especially right now with the displacement in South Lebanon, they're taking in any queer children or teenagers or adults. And I think those are the places to donate because they're really doing the most that they can out there.

Suzy Chase: Those are some good tips. Thank you. Thank you for speaking on this too. Of course. So moving on, two lighter things. So much of your story has really touched my heart, but I think most of all is your neighborhood deli that's now Eddie's grocer in Greenpoint, Brooklyn. It's just the most fabulous story. Can you talk a little bit about it?

Edy Massih: Of course. I've been living on this block now for eight years, and I fell in love with Maria's Deli, which is what it used to be, a Polish deli, right? When I moved onto the block, I used to go and get my Turkey sandwiches from there. On Friday she would do a fried fish sandwich. She made the best chicken cutlets. Oh, I miss that chicken cutlet sandwich. But I used to go in all the time and I really became good friends with Maria. And after a while I would drop off little snacks from catering events and she would make me a big batch of coffee because I didn't have a big coffee machine for my catering. And we just became good friends. I mean, honestly, to me, she was like my grandmother on the block. It was just so sweet. And over the years we just got to know each other better.

And then when the pandemic happened, she closed down and she was planning on reopening, but then when things just kept getting worse and worse, she was ready to retire. So that is when I called her in May of 2020 and I was like, would you want to transition now? And she said yes. And that is when we kind of started working on things and I signed the lease July 1st and we got to work. We flipped the space in six weeks, which was, now that I think about it, six weeks is an insane amount of time so fast. But back then, because we had nothing else to do, it was just the perfect time, perfect timing in a way. And so yeah, we flipped it from a Polish deli that had been there for 43 years to a Lebanese grocer, and I think there's a lot of really cool history there.

Both Marie and I migrated from our own countries, but we were both immigrants and she took over the deli when she was 25. I took it over when I was 25. We're both Sagittarius and I don't have any kids, but she had kids. So I think there's a lot of things that align there, and I think that's really beautiful because you really don't see that as much anymore, especially Greenpoint Williamsburg. You've got all these crazy real estate developers coming in, flipping these buildings. Commercial real estate is kind of completely changing. I mean, we're getting a sweet green two blocks away, but it's kind of ever so changing and it's not mom and pop being passed down anymore. And so I think there's something really beautiful about that.

Suzy Chase: So in the cookbook, you remind us that you're not our Lebanese grandmother. Talk a little bit about that, and I want you to talk about your grandmother, Odette.

Edy Massih: I'm saying it to you straight to your face. I'm not your Lebanese grandmother, because I think a lot of Lebanese people would come into the grocery store and be like, well, that's not how my grandmother made it, or That's not how my grandmother cooked it, or that's not how my mom made it, and I'm not your mom. I'm not your grandmother. You know what I mean? At the end of the day, nobody has time. Our grandmothers did anymore to cook. They did. They had all day long to plan, cook and prep and do all that. We are in just such a fast-paced environment now, especially having a restaurant, you have to cut corners. And the way I think about it is not just cutting corners, but also trying to make things last longer. So our tabouli is made with kale and set of parsley. There's parsley in it, but it's not fully made of parsley because nobody has enough time to chop up all that parsley, parsley, wilts so fast that it will only last in the fridge for a day where kale lasts in the fridge for three days.

So it just had to make sense for us. So there's a lot of things that there's little shortcuts or things that I change up. Also in the tabouli, we don't use bulgar, we use couscous because couscous holds up better and doesn't, water doesn't really come out of it. It's a pasta where bulgar, you're kind of soaking it in water and then sometimes a lot of water will come out of it later on in the process. So it just doesn't hold as well. There's all these little things that I do to prevent things from going bad faster, especially when it's all fresh food that we make. That's what I have to say about that. Then my grandmother, Odette, I love her so much and she just taught me how to be in the kitchen overall. She taught me how to make kitchen and cooking part of life, part of daily life, and I think she just put so much love in the food that she made every day. I mean, it was her full-time job, and she really took it seriously and it's become my full-time job, and I take it very seriously as well. So I think I learned a lot from her, and I learned how to cook with the heart, with the eyes with the nose, rather than following a recipe tasting as I go. Things like that. And of course those are things that they try to teach you in college, but I think it's really truly embedded in you more than anything else.

Suzy Chase: And she did everything with a paralyzed left hand.

Edy Massih: Yes.

Suzy Chase: Yeah, that's crazy.

Edy Massih: Now I'm like, I don't know how she did that.

Suzy Chase: And

Edy Massih: It was paralyzed like this so she could hold it up, but the actual hand itself was not moving. And so now is crazy to me because whenever I'm in the kitchen, I'm like, I wish I had an extra set of hands. I wish I had toilet and thought too. So I can't even imagine doing everything that she did with one hand. So especially chopping and I mean she used to chop so much or kind of skewering, kafta and things like that. It's like you really need two hands for those things. So I'll never understand how she did all that.

Suzy Chase: So on the same day you got your driver's license, the Oprah Winfrey show ended. I think we all have an Oprah quote at the ready. Mine is doubt means don't, but yours is surround yourself with only people who are going to lift you higher.

Edy Massih: That is truly one of my favorite quotes from her, especially in New York, especially in this social media age that we're in, especially in this food creators content, whatever you want to call it, world that we're living in now. I think that a lot of people are friends with each other on social media, but they're really fake to each other in real life, or they don't actually mean well for each other. So I think there's something really big about that, and I think that we're all trying to make it some way somehow. And so I think there's a lot of people that will throw you under the bus or do things that are not to help you out, but to kind of make them feel better about themselves. So I think it's all about people that want to lift you up. And I think to me, I'm surrounded by amazing people at the grocer, especially my best friend Mila, who's our head chef at the Grocer. And I think there's a lot of jealousy nowadays, and a lot of people, like every line cook and every sous chef really wants to be the head chef eventually and wants to become the name of it all. And so I think it's really nice to find people that are there to help you keep growing while they're growing themselves, but not trying to steal that name away.

Suzy Chase: So something I love about Lebanese cuisine are the spices. And you talk about how you are hard pressed, defined Lebanese representation in the food scene in New York. And the only Lebanese restaurant I know of in the city is one of my favorite restaurants, and I'm going to butcher this name. Ly Lilly.

Edy Massih: Yeah, ily. Yeah,

Suzy Chase: I am obsessed with it. So in the cookbook, you talk about giving your spice cabinet a workout, and I'm curious about the spices you use most.

Edy Massih: I mean, I think that's one thing that when I move to the US I realized people just don't use spices now. People use it a lot more than they used to, but I think it is really crazy. When I moved here, it was like salt and black pepper, especially in Boston. So I think that was really crazy to me. But in general, I used of course a lot of zatar, Aleppo, pepper, sumac, cumin. I love cumin, cumin seeds and ground cumin. And then I would say outside of those four shawarma seasoning, which is a mixture of different things, or bahara, which is our seven pepper spice mix. And to me, bahara is a very wintery clove, coriander, cardamom, a little bit of cinnamon in there. So it's more of a warmish spice. But I would think my top four would be Aleppo, pepper, zatar, sumac, and cumin.

Suzy Chase: So in the cookbook, you write the lactate because who can live without loney? What is your go-to to dip into labneh

Edy Massih: Chips?

Suzy Chase: What kind of chips?

Edy Massih: I love a potato chip. I love Cape Cod chips. I love a kettle chip. I love a Cape Cod chip, but people might get crazy with this, but I love Kirkland, AK Costco's brands, Himalayan salt chips. They're so good. And I like to warm them up for a minute in the air fryer or in the oven, and then sprinkle some sumac on top to add a little zestiness to them. I mean, they're divine, truly divine, I would say that, or just a plain old good old Persian cucumber.

Suzy Chase: Tell me about your signature brown paperboard.

Edy Massih: The brown pit board is something that I started many moons ago now, and I know now grazing tables are all over social media, but I started it literally totally by accident. I showed up to a catering and I forgot to bring my platters. And my good friend Ross was a stylist on set, and he was like, oh, I have brown paper, just throw it right on there. And I was like, oh my God. And I remember it was like a taco lunch, and I was like, are you sure? And he was like, just do it. And that's what I did. I put the flour tortillas down, I had the rice and the chicken and stuff in the aluminums, and I put all the condiments and stuff around it, like the cheese and things like that right on the board and it worked. And I was like, oh my God, I don't have to bring platters anymore to catering.

This is major. And because back in the days when I used to do breakfast and lunch catering for studios, I would go in the morning, set up breakfast, come back, do lunch, go back, set up lunch, come back, and then go back and pick up my platters to come back to drive Tribeca Green Point, Tribeca Green Point. So I'd go back and forth three times, and that is hellish. I mean, I was young so I could do it. I don't think I could do it now. And so it really changed my life not to have to go back after lunch service because not going back after lunch service was the biggest thing to just keep going on the prep and doing all the dishes and stuff, and then you're cutting your dishes in half. And also in New York, you don't have enough space for all these platters and things.

So it made things just much easier. But I think as I grew and started doing more and more cocktail parties and stuff, I felt like people at cocktail parties, even though the clients were spending so much money on the food, people were not enjoying the food they're eating. The quick od d'oeuvre really fast, and there just wasn't enough talk about the food. It was just drink, drink, drink. And so I was really excited to start doing these colorful brown paper boards because it a brought people together around the table. It got people to talk about the food. Did you taste this? Did you taste that? And it made the food part of the event, which I felt like all these cocktail parties were like the food was there, but it wasn't a moment. And I feel like me and other caterers work our asses off to put all this food together, and then you end up eating a few bites and just drinking the night away where you should be enjoying the food. So I just wanted the food to be kind of the center of attention. And it started just started off like that. And it's been my thing ever since. I do at least four to five brown paper boards a week. It's crazy.

Suzy Chase: Really? Oh yeah. And you trademarked it.

Edy Massih: That took a lot of work. It's crazy. Trademarking things is insane.

Suzy Chase: So over the weekend I made a couple of your recipes. I made the orangey date carrot dip on page 49, and I'm always looking for a new dip to wow people. This was literally restaurant level.

Edy Massih: I love that. It's one of those dips that I came up with for fall purposes, and it just stuck. I think the orange with the cumin and the carrot all just blend really well together, and it is really having a fall dip just there for you.

Suzy Chase: And I think the trick is the date molasses. I don't think it would've been as good, thank goodness I found the date molasses at my grocery store. But I think that's what makes it,

Edy Massih: Yeah, I think it adds that nice sweetness to it.

Suzy Chase: And it's not maple syrup.

Edy Massih: Not maple syrup. It's like a change of past without having it be maple syrup. And I feel like date molasses is a tad bit sweet, but it's not crazy sweet. And because it's a molasses and thick, it kind of brings that dip together really nicely.

Suzy Chase: So next to the date molasses was rosewater, and I was thinking, what do I do with this? But then I got home and I was reading your cookbook and you have a lot of recipes with rosewater in it.

Edy Massih: Rosewater is something that I grew up with all the time, and it is mainly used in sweets. I added to a few things outside of sweets. There's a ricotta with that in there with some honey and things like that. But rosewater to a lot of people is kind of a beauty thing. It's not something to cook with, but you use it in moderation. It is floral, but it is, I think to me really delicious floral of flavors. It's like you using chamomile or jasmine in cooking. It's kind of the same thing.

Suzy Chase: And then I made your lemony chicken orzo soup on page one 18, and that is the perfect soup for any night. And you say this is your whole childhood in a bowl.

Edy Massih: It really is because nothing's like homemade chicken stock. Of course you can use store-bought, don't get me wrong. But to me, homemade chicken stock is just the way to go. That is what I remember being in my grandmother's house, especially during the wintertime, is she always had chicken stock simmering. And I love a rotis read chicken, and that's what I use it in the cookbook and lover rotisserie chicken. I could write a whole cookbook about rotisserie chicken. I literally love rotisserie chicken. So I think that is the best thing to use for this soup. And I think it just makes it so much easier and of course, more flavorful.

Suzy Chase: I love the lemon

Edy Massih: Acid. And soup to me is major. And when I first moved to this country and started having soup, chicken soup, especially, it didn't have lemon, I was like, what is it missing? What is that thing? And then when my mom was like, got to add lemon to this, and I was like, oh, it just changed soup for me forever.

Suzy Chase: I know I grew up in Kansas and I didn't know I was missing the lemon in my chicken soup.

Edy Massih: It just really brightens it up, brings it together. And also what I like about that recipe is cooking the orzo separately. So cooking your pasta separately is major, major key to this.

Suzy Chase: Oh, I love it. I'm going to make this all winter long.

Edy Massih: Thank you.

Suzy Chase: And the dip too.

Edy Massih: The dip is like that's a go-to for sure.

Suzy Chase: Oh my God. I mean, I can't wait to make this for people. I made it for my husband and he was like, this is amazing.

Edy Massih: Oh, I love that. That's

Suzy Chase: Great. So you write in the cookbook the burden of being bullied, of being called names and the pressure to speak unaccented English all dissipated as I rolled out Pillsbury pie crust to make my own version of savory mini croissants. I believe to have an accent in the United States of America is one of the most courageous, smartest and bravest things. But beyond your culinary achievements, you are a strong advocate for cultural representation and diversity in the culinary world. Can you chat a little bit about that?

Edy Massih: Of course. I mean, I think to me, when I first moved to New York and I started working in kitchens, I mean kitchens in general. It's weird because TV kitchens are mainly women and food network stars are mainly women. But then you get into the kitchen in New York and it's all heterosexual men that are just nasty. And that environment is kind of nasty in so many ways. I couldn't wait to get out of restaurant kitchens. I really, really couldn't wait. That's why I was really excited when I started catering because I could be my own boss. But B, I think it was just like there was more fun to it. And there isn't somebody behind you being like, why are you doing this this way? Why are you doing that that way? And there's hostility there as well. And so I think to me, I'm always trying to advocate and also grow a family in our kitchen.

And at the grocer, we all accept each other no matter what. And I think that is really key and major. And I think just being vulnerable and caring, especially in a kitchen environment, because a kitchen environment on its own is so stressful. It's a lot all at once. When we get a big rush, you're in the weeds. You're just like, it's all happening. And then it's like after that, the, what's the word? Reaffirmation or the recognition, but it's not for the people that eat it. It's more the recognition within the kitchen space of being like, well, that was a great service, good job. Or That was a great catering event. Thank you for all your help. And I think there just isn't that in the restaurant industry. And it's like, what's tomorrow's service? What do we have tomorrow on the books? What's going on tomorrow?

How many numbers did we hit tonight? How many tables did we serve? How much tip did we make? And I think there's just that always that up and up and up. And so I think for me, all I care about is how are we doing right now? How are we doing as a team? How can we help each other out? And are we all mentally stable? I think the older generation missed in a way, like that mental health aspect of things. And I think that's a huge thing right now in the restaurant world is being pushed. Mental health, mental health, mental health. And I think sometimes it has skipped a generation so much that it's hard to embed that into their brains, to slay into the gate.

Suzy Chase: I feel like you're the next generation of food and hospitality. I

Edy Massih: Mean, I hope so. I've learned from the best. I worked for Danny Meyer for many years, and I always look up to him and everything that he's done, and I think there's only growth from here. I think one thing about him is making sure front of the house and back of the house is all equal. And there's just so much that goes into that. Really the next step here is to keep talking about mental health and not to just talk about this chef overdosed or this chef passed away because of this. I think talking a bit more about that and kind of making that become a topic in a way to make things better, not just shunning that person for doing that.

Suzy Chase: So when life gives you lemons, you keep it zesty. That's what you say. Along with these gorgeous recipes. You have a lemonade chart. Talk a little bit about your love of lemonade.

Edy Massih: Oh, I love lemonade. In Lebanon, we have lemonade carts. There's a place that only sells lemonade. There's a place like that in Newport, Rhode Island, which I love. But I just love lemonade, obviously. I love lemon. So lemonade is just so delicious. And I think in Lebanon there's a variety of lemonade. And that's what I wanted to bring here to the book. There's a cucumber lemonade. A mint lemonade. I think there's a strawberry lemonade, blackberry lemonade.

Suzy Chase: Rosewater.

Edy Massih: Rosewater lemonade, of course. And you can always add a hint of vodka tequila to it to make it a party. But I just think to me, lemonade is like summer. It's the most refreshing summer drink. It's tart. It's a little sweet, not too sweet, and it's just so refreshing and delicious. So of course, I had to put that in the book, and I couldn't just do one lemonade. I was like, we got to add all the variations of lemonade that I love.

Suzy Chase: Did you see that video of the guy at San Janero and he was making lemonade from the fire hydrant water? Did you see that video? No. It's all over TikTok.

Edy Massih: I don't know if I would drink that. I'm

Suzy Chase: Sorry. No, no, thanks.

Edy Massih: Absolutely not. The fire hydrants I feel like are so crusty on the inside. I would never, never. Oh

Suzy Chase: God. Oh my God. Yu Okay now for my segment called the Perfect Bite where I ask you to describe your perfect bite of your favorite dish.

Edy Massih: Lately it's been like a year plus. I've been obsessed with these savory oats. They're from James James Park, one of my good friends, a cookbook called Chili Crisp, and it's like savory oats with chili crisp. It's oats chicken stock, chili crisp, a little soy sauce, a little miso. Cook it for like four to five minutes with some smoked salmon on top. I eat it at least three to four times a week.

Suzy Chase: Really?

Edy Massih: It's like I know. I know. It's very weird. I love a toast with Greek yogurt and smoked salmon, hard boiled egg with smoked salmon, those oats with smoked salmon. I'm like a huge smoked salmon person.

Suzy Chase: I mean, I get all that, but the oats, that just sounds so weird. Can I say that?

Edy Massih: No, it's totally fine. You can say that I'm not a sweet gal whatsoever at all. At all. So I will always pick savory over sweet. But I love that. I know people will think this is, I love that mus of the oats of and the saltiness of it. I don't know what it is. It's like eating porridge in a way, but for me, it's so much better. Oh, it's so good. It's so good. I know it's not your perfect bite, but it's my perfect bite.

Suzy Chase: No, it might be. I'm going to try it. It might be my perfect bite. Yeah. So where can we find you in Brooklyn and on the web and social media?

Edy Massih: You can find me at Edy's Grocer. Everybody spells it like Edy. I call it Eddie. We are on the corner of Meserole Avenue, not Street and Eckford in Greenpoint off the Nassau G. Or you can walk from the Bedford L. It's a quick 12 minute walk. from McCarren Park? You can find me at Edy Massih, E-D-Y-M-A-S-S-I-H or E-D-Y-M-A-S-S-I h.com.

Suzy Chase: Well, thank you so much, Edy for coming on Dinner Party Podcast. Thank you. I love this book so much. Yeah, that's so sweet.

Edy Massih: Thank you. Thank you.

Suzy Chase: Okay, so where can you listen to the new Dinner Party podcast series? Well, it's on Substack suzy chase.substack.com. You can also subscribe to Dinner Party for free on Spotify and Apple Podcasts. Additionally, the episodes will be available on both Decorating by the Book and Cookery by the Book. Long story short, you'll be able to listen to it virtually everywhere. Thanks for listening. Bye.